We’ve just released Episode 158 of the Thunder Down Under Chargers Podcast
Our synopsis is below:
#BoltUp! A nightmare scenario at Highmark Stadium. Despite winning the turnover battle 5-1 and leading into the 4th quarter, the Chargers collapse in a 24-16 loss to the Buffalo Bills. At 0-3, the playoff outlook is terrifying, and the anger across Charger Nation has reached a boiling point. Today on Thunder Down Under Chargers, we break down where it all went wrong and demand answers from this coaching staff.
What we cover today:
⚡ Bills Recap & The 5-Turnover Meltdown: How the Bolts managed to lose a game despite forcing 5 takeaways, and why the Offense went ultra-conservative when they had the momentum.
✅❌ Yeah/Nah & Nah/Yeah Awards: Andy and Alister hand out their weekly stock-check awards. Who deserves praise despite the disaster, and who gets called out for the costliest failures against Buffalo?
🎓#TeachableMoment: Jack takes the whiteboard to analyse the structural flaws in Mike McDaniel’s offense, Herbert’s recent struggles, and what must change immediately if this team is to save its season.
You can also listen on Spotify below (or download on audio wherever you like to listen to podcasts)
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Hope you enjoy the episode! Thanks so much for listening 🙂
Long time team fan, podcaster (with Thunder Down Under Chargers Podcast), husband to a beautiful wife, friend to all fellow Chargers fanatics, and father-to-be!
Jack’s point about the way the Coaches talk to the Media vs how they talk to the team can’t be the same is spot-on.
It’s one thing to react broadly as a fan in the moment on Gameday (see the LG sucks!) its quite another to be a coach who can correct how to block a 3T or scheme away from it and that’s been one of the concerns with Jim as he gets older as a CEO style coach. Players need answers and if all you have is HS level rah-rah solutions they tune you out.
What really bothers me as I think about it more though is just how this team continues to force Justin to throw to QJ as is his primary X and how they’ve tried to look at stats to argue what the eyes have told us is so obvious. Its such a Gambler’s Fallacy to think that “this is the year” for QJ to finally do it rather than having simply moved on and found the guy who can be counted on outside.
Perhaps all of this is why Harbaugh has ranked lower than expected on some of those player report cards you see surfacing online annually?
I recall one question was about whether the coaches respect the players’ time, or are efficient with it, and the responses being fairly negative. When you think about Harbaugh presents to media, that’s no surprise really!
Listened to the show yesterday. I have the same feeling as Jack, fuck off indeed. I’m done trying to hear about scheme fits and players familiar with the system. How is that working now? You get good players and you figure it out. Hortiz and Harbaugh let MM have to much say on personnel and the IOL and weapons are garbage. This is year 3 of the regime and it’s the worst version of the team they have put on the field and it’s the same issues we saw last 2 years (IOL, weapons) and new holes created this year (CB, LB). This is looking like an 0-6 team at the bye and a 1-9 start is possible. Maybe this is what the team needs? If we aren’t going to spend in FA correctly, we might as well get the highest possible draft pick in every round, since that’s the only way Hortiz knows how to add decent talent to the team. I feel terrible for Mack. Get that guy to a contender ASAP.
Loving the extra preview show. I enjoy the breakdown and the extra content. I was listening in the car while driving and the audio of Jack and Al were fine, but Andy’s mic was a little low, FWIW. As always, keep up the great content and I will look forward to the preview, even if we can probably expect the same result.
I would 100% trade Mack and QJ (even for a can of beans). They should also consider trading Slater when some playoff caliber team gets desperate. McDaniel hire appears to be a failure and they’re going to be picking in the top 10. Its amazing that guys that specifically were brought in for MM’s system have been so bad. Like Ingold and Strange. They’ve been terrible blockers and theoretically should’ve been the most ahead of the pack on understanding the techniques and where to be. Its crazy how many blocks those two have whiffed on. I really liked the idea of signing Ingold too but what do I know.
Need to just try and have a monster restock draft and go from there. Even the really good franchises have a reset every handful of years, it is what it is.
Seattle could actually be a team that might have interest in Mack since Dante Fowler Jr hasn’t done anything in a reserve role and they haven’t had a good start from their Edge room. I also wonder if the “cost” of the trade is that we also send QJ for Rasheed Shaheed and the teams trade WR contracts in the hope that they’re a better fit on different teams. (QJ could ostensibly be the big body outside they lack; Shaheed is competent but out of place with Kupp)
The idea of trading Slater is an outside the box way of looking at adding talent, ostensibly at WR or CB to give a boost to another position group in need of talent. I tend to shy away though from trading guys I’d label as “solutions” and not “problems” even if his Buffalo tape was abnormal for him.
My suggestion to trade Slater wasn’t due to the Buffalo game. It was simply that if they can garner real assets for him meaning like a top 75ish pick) I think the Chargers would have to consider it. Get out of his contract, roll with Alt and Burke as the tackles and let’s not forget Isaiah World probably would’ve been a top 100 pick if not for the injury. They have some young talent at the position in other words.
Going into the draft with like 5 top 100 picks vs 3 would go a long way.
Slater has been fine and he’s coming off a major injury. He will probably continue to get better. You don’t trade top tier LT, especially when there is zero proof this regime knows how to build the IOL. Trading Slater just creates more holes than it solves. Plus his cap hit probably restricts him from being traded until at least ‘28
What will be interesting to monitor moving forward is the depth of Slater’s kick slide and whether he can protect his corner.
He lost 4 reps to Chubb and Rousseau cleanly on Sunday, where they were able to get around him and affect Herbert. On one of them, Herbert still converted an incredible 3rd & 15 to McConkey between two defenders. This issue for Slater didn’t show up Wks 1-2 against Edge groups who aren’t as talented IMO (The Raiders obviously have Crosby, but he rushes on the other side).
If Slater starts becoming a guy who can’t win against speed/bend because of his patella recovery, he will cease being a top tier LT. On Sunday, my rating for his play was ‘bad’. He played worse than Penning or Slaughter in pass pro IMO. Eager to see how he bounces back this week.
Erick, we noticed Andy’s microphone in post-production too (he accidentally didn’t have a certain setting turned on which we couldn’t do anything about and will correct on the next show). Thanks for letting us know anyway though!
There’s one approach to sports analysis where I’m on an island, I think. I get angry and disappointed early on during seasons but I don’t get hysterical.
And the reason is an 0-4 team has the power to get to 4-4. Teams that start hot and are the talk of the town (remember McDaniel hanging 70+ points on the Broncos?) come back to earth, often enough, and vice versa.
I’ve seen McDaniel coach good Offenses before. I’ve said Herbert play great football before. Is it possible that they’ve totally screwed this offseason program and it won’t improve? Yes it is. But I have just as much faith that things will begin to click over the next few weeks and fans may be singing a different tune by mid-season. The problem with the early season losses though is it might all be too late because of the hole that’s been dug, and the hope instead becomes that the 2027 season is the year to push the chips in.
For those reasons, I give seasons about 10 games before forming strong views. I could easily see us losing in Seattle (0-4) but then winning successive division games against well-known opponents in the Broncos & Chiefs. And then, from there, who knows what happens. Another scenario is the 0-6 team you posit, and at that point, there really won’t be very much to say in support of the season turning around. We may end up there.
It’s been a sh*t start to the season, there’s no doubt. But when you go too hard, too early with the vitriol as a fan (fire Hortiz, fire Harbaugh, trade Herbert, fire McDaniel!), my experience is more often than not hindsight proves you have been a hot head with poor judgment. (Not you specifically, just generally).
Agreed. I am not on the level of firing people, but the NFL is set up in a way that if you are not competing for a playoff, it promotes losing as an avenue to improvement. The worst thing this team could do it go 8-9,7-10 and be in no man’s land at the back end of the non playoff teams in the draft.
That might also again have this regime thinking that the slow start was due to a new system and that the personnel is fine, which it is not. I think they lose again this week which puts any visions of playoffs out of reach. Once that happens it’s tank season.
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Jack’s point about the way the Coaches talk to the Media vs how they talk to the team can’t be the same is spot-on.
It’s one thing to react broadly as a fan in the moment on Gameday (see the LG sucks!) its quite another to be a coach who can correct how to block a 3T or scheme away from it and that’s been one of the concerns with Jim as he gets older as a CEO style coach. Players need answers and if all you have is HS level rah-rah solutions they tune you out.
What really bothers me as I think about it more though is just how this team continues to force Justin to throw to QJ as is his primary X and how they’ve tried to look at stats to argue what the eyes have told us is so obvious. Its such a Gambler’s Fallacy to think that “this is the year” for QJ to finally do it rather than having simply moved on and found the guy who can be counted on outside.
Well said, Duck.
Perhaps all of this is why Harbaugh has ranked lower than expected on some of those player report cards you see surfacing online annually?
I recall one question was about whether the coaches respect the players’ time, or are efficient with it, and the responses being fairly negative. When you think about Harbaugh presents to media, that’s no surprise really!
Listened to the show yesterday. I have the same feeling as Jack, fuck off indeed. I’m done trying to hear about scheme fits and players familiar with the system. How is that working now? You get good players and you figure it out. Hortiz and Harbaugh let MM have to much say on personnel and the IOL and weapons are garbage. This is year 3 of the regime and it’s the worst version of the team they have put on the field and it’s the same issues we saw last 2 years (IOL, weapons) and new holes created this year (CB, LB). This is looking like an 0-6 team at the bye and a 1-9 start is possible. Maybe this is what the team needs? If we aren’t going to spend in FA correctly, we might as well get the highest possible draft pick in every round, since that’s the only way Hortiz knows how to add decent talent to the team. I feel terrible for Mack. Get that guy to a contender ASAP.
Loving the extra preview show. I enjoy the breakdown and the extra content. I was listening in the car while driving and the audio of Jack and Al were fine, but Andy’s mic was a little low, FWIW. As always, keep up the great content and I will look forward to the preview, even if we can probably expect the same result.
I would 100% trade Mack and QJ (even for a can of beans). They should also consider trading Slater when some playoff caliber team gets desperate. McDaniel hire appears to be a failure and they’re going to be picking in the top 10. Its amazing that guys that specifically were brought in for MM’s system have been so bad. Like Ingold and Strange. They’ve been terrible blockers and theoretically should’ve been the most ahead of the pack on understanding the techniques and where to be. Its crazy how many blocks those two have whiffed on. I really liked the idea of signing Ingold too but what do I know.
Need to just try and have a monster restock draft and go from there. Even the really good franchises have a reset every handful of years, it is what it is.
Seattle could actually be a team that might have interest in Mack since Dante Fowler Jr hasn’t done anything in a reserve role and they haven’t had a good start from their Edge room. I also wonder if the “cost” of the trade is that we also send QJ for Rasheed Shaheed and the teams trade WR contracts in the hope that they’re a better fit on different teams. (QJ could ostensibly be the big body outside they lack; Shaheed is competent but out of place with Kupp)
The idea of trading Slater is an outside the box way of looking at adding talent, ostensibly at WR or CB to give a boost to another position group in need of talent. I tend to shy away though from trading guys I’d label as “solutions” and not “problems” even if his Buffalo tape was abnormal for him.
My suggestion to trade Slater wasn’t due to the Buffalo game. It was simply that if they can garner real assets for him meaning like a top 75ish pick) I think the Chargers would have to consider it. Get out of his contract, roll with Alt and Burke as the tackles and let’s not forget Isaiah World probably would’ve been a top 100 pick if not for the injury. They have some young talent at the position in other words.
Going into the draft with like 5 top 100 picks vs 3 would go a long way.
Slater has been fine and he’s coming off a major injury. He will probably continue to get better. You don’t trade top tier LT, especially when there is zero proof this regime knows how to build the IOL. Trading Slater just creates more holes than it solves. Plus his cap hit probably restricts him from being traded until at least ‘28
What will be interesting to monitor moving forward is the depth of Slater’s kick slide and whether he can protect his corner.
He lost 4 reps to Chubb and Rousseau cleanly on Sunday, where they were able to get around him and affect Herbert. On one of them, Herbert still converted an incredible 3rd & 15 to McConkey between two defenders. This issue for Slater didn’t show up Wks 1-2 against Edge groups who aren’t as talented IMO (The Raiders obviously have Crosby, but he rushes on the other side).
If Slater starts becoming a guy who can’t win against speed/bend because of his patella recovery, he will cease being a top tier LT. On Sunday, my rating for his play was ‘bad’. He played worse than Penning or Slaughter in pass pro IMO. Eager to see how he bounces back this week.
Erick, we noticed Andy’s microphone in post-production too (he accidentally didn’t have a certain setting turned on which we couldn’t do anything about and will correct on the next show). Thanks for letting us know anyway though!
There’s one approach to sports analysis where I’m on an island, I think. I get angry and disappointed early on during seasons but I don’t get hysterical.
And the reason is an 0-4 team has the power to get to 4-4. Teams that start hot and are the talk of the town (remember McDaniel hanging 70+ points on the Broncos?) come back to earth, often enough, and vice versa.
I’ve seen McDaniel coach good Offenses before. I’ve said Herbert play great football before. Is it possible that they’ve totally screwed this offseason program and it won’t improve? Yes it is. But I have just as much faith that things will begin to click over the next few weeks and fans may be singing a different tune by mid-season. The problem with the early season losses though is it might all be too late because of the hole that’s been dug, and the hope instead becomes that the 2027 season is the year to push the chips in.
For those reasons, I give seasons about 10 games before forming strong views. I could easily see us losing in Seattle (0-4) but then winning successive division games against well-known opponents in the Broncos & Chiefs. And then, from there, who knows what happens. Another scenario is the 0-6 team you posit, and at that point, there really won’t be very much to say in support of the season turning around. We may end up there.
It’s been a sh*t start to the season, there’s no doubt. But when you go too hard, too early with the vitriol as a fan (fire Hortiz, fire Harbaugh, trade Herbert, fire McDaniel!), my experience is more often than not hindsight proves you have been a hot head with poor judgment. (Not you specifically, just generally).
Agreed. I am not on the level of firing people, but the NFL is set up in a way that if you are not competing for a playoff, it promotes losing as an avenue to improvement. The worst thing this team could do it go 8-9,7-10 and be in no man’s land at the back end of the non playoff teams in the draft.
That might also again have this regime thinking that the slow start was due to a new system and that the personnel is fine, which it is not. I think they lose again this week which puts any visions of playoffs out of reach. Once that happens it’s tank season.