We’ve just released Episode 147 of the Thunder Down Under Chargers Podcast.
Our synopsis is below:
The Charger players have been working hard at OTAs and Mandatory Minicamp. But have the TDU boys been grinding too during their time off? Or have they been busy following their popstar wives on a global musical tour? Find out today as we bring you our Biggest Chargers Offseason Takeaways to kickstart Season 5 of TDU. Is the Bolts’ Interior OL still a problem? Are McDaniel and Herbert fully in synch (with their footwork and their minds)? Now that the picture is almost complete, how do we grade Joe Hortiz’s roster building efforts? We discuss it all #BoltFam. Don’t miss it!
You can also listen on Spotify below (or download on audio wherever you like to listen to podcasts):
As always, you can support us by doing any or all of the following:
– Rec’ing this post and leaving any thoughts/feedback you have in the comments section below.
– Following us on Twitter (and ‘liking’ our tweets) at @TDU_Chargers, or individually, at @TDU_Alister, @TDU_Jack and @TDU_Andy.
– ‘Subscribing’ to our YouTube channel, clicking the ‘Like’ button for today’s episode, and engaging with us in the comments section.
– Giving us a rating and leaving a review on the Thunder Down Under Podcast page on Apple Podcasts (and ‘subscribing’).
– Spreading the good word to all of your awesome Chargers friends and family and encouraging them to listen to our show (and engage with us on social media).
Hope you enjoy the episode! Thanks so much for listening 🙂
Alister (@TDU_Alister)
Long time team fan, podcaster (with Thunder Down Under Chargers Podcast), husband to a beautiful wife, friend to all fellow Chargers fanatics, and father-to-be!
View All Articles →
Hey guys….currently on a 2 week motorcycle trip, watched the latest while holed up for a rain day in Berkeley Springs WV. Congratulations on a great kickoff of a new season. Kris was a fun guest. Good stuff.
Another week-ish and we’re into training camp. Tis the season for optimism! I’m hoping for health, O’Leary having success, and the McDaniels’ offense blowing the league away.
Go Bolts!!! ⚡️⚡️⚡️
Uhhhh….just realized that I think I replied to the wrong podcast thread….duh!! lol
But the sentiment is still the same. 🙂
Great hearing from you Buck!
To think that somewhere in WV you’re holed up inside watching us on YouTube due to bad weather is so cool. These global connections are a magical thing and honestly a cure for many of the world’s ills. Spreading love and awareness of different cultures across borders, and exposing people to different opinions (for entertainment purposes anyway…), is largely why we do this! And we also want to see a Chargers Super Bowl…
Thanks for listening to us for another season and hope you’re keeping well!
That’s a big reason I travel and try to embed myself with the locals as much as possible.
It’s not just the destination, it’s the journey. 🙂
Welcome back and congrats on Season 5. Like Kev, I have listened to every episode and boy you guys have done a great job building this show. I am a little behind my podcast listening as I have been traveling, so I was happy to see the new episode in my subscriptions, but I was disappointed that there was no following of Pop Star wives to hear about.
I know this is the time of year when hope springs eternal for the upcoming season so I understand the over arching excitement and enthusiasm, but I have to push back a little on the offseason grades. My grade is a conditional B. It will be higher if the team stays relatively healthy and avoids us diving to deep into the depth.
Like you said the depth is good, but a lot of that depth is unproven, so just because it’s a body, doesn’t mean it’s capable.
They are trying to fit round pegs in square holes (Slaughter at OG) to make the offensive line work when they had enough cap space to build it with better pieces than Awosika, Strange, Penning, and Pipkins. If there is an injury to Biadasz, Slaughter is a good option at center, but then the musical chairs start at OG. Are you confident in any of the reserves (Awosika, Penning, Pipkins, Taylor, Harkey) stepping in? I am intrigued by Burke at OT, but would you be comfortable starting him? Slater is an injury risk and it’s yet to be seen his level of play recovering from last year and Alt been in the league two seasons and essentially missed all of one of them and has his own recovery from a shredded ankle. In a “Super Bowl window” season I would have liked to see a little better veteran depth to try and insulate against the inevitable injuries that will occur.
** Possible players we could have added and have the space for: Dillon Radunz, Chris Paul, Elijah Wilkinson, Teven Jenkins
You guys touched on the LB depth. I was a proponent of adding another vet to the unit. Colson is a complete wildcard and might not even make the team. If any two of Dye, Perryman or Henley go down the unit is extremely thin IMO.
** Possible players we could have added and have the space for: Malcolm Rodriguez, Akheem Davis-Gaither, Christian Harris, Jack Gibbens
The same can be said at CB. Hart has had the injury bug hit every year and outside of Jackson and Still who do you have confidence at plugging in for a longer term injury? Reed? Leonard? Rogers? Another veteran body here should have been added.
** Possible players we could have added and had the space for: Jonathan Jones, Cam Taylor Britt, Avonte Maddox, Kader Kohou.
My main point is they are still straddling the fence on going all in. The come out guns blazing with the McDaniel signing and you think, this is it, they recognize Herbert is in his prime and they are going to do everything they can because they recognize they have a window to win. Then they go into FA with the 3rd most space in the league and sit on their hands when they didn’t have to. If we get hit with the injuries again will anyone look at the $ we saved and be understanding? They didn’t need to spend like drunks, but they had enough resources to be stronger across the roster and still have $ left over. There was no reason to have UDFA and day 3 rookies be considered quality depth at some positions.
Like I said, my grade is a B. If their bank on health proves them right, then it will go higher.
Anyway, it’s great to hear you guys back again. Looking forward to another TDU season.
Thanks Erick for the kind words and considered commentary, as you always provide!
I like that you put your money where your mouth is and listed some of the guys you think we could have signed instead of the guys we did sign. Rasul Douglas is another to add to the CB list.
Today, we had an exciting opportunity to do a show with Kris Rhim who covers the team for ESPN. He didn’t share this with us but referred to a list of players he was aware of that the team had some interest in signing heading into FA but ultimately didn’t sign. He thought there was room for fans to validly criticise Hortiz for not being more aggressive.
I think knowing that list would be instructive, because a lot of the pieces you’ve referred to above are depth pieces (at least, in my opinion). I don’t think Radunz is better than the guys we signed. Teven Jenkins probably is but has some lows on the field that are worse than Becton’s.
The real room for potential criticism would sit at the top of the free agency market. But I don’t know the guys that were considered. And when going through the list at the time, I didn’t love the free agency class as a whole.
I would have supported an aggressive move to acquire a super star (AJ Brown, Myles Garrett, etc). But if the major critique is missing out on guys like Seumalo and Elgton Jenkins, I find it tough to be too critical, not knowing if those players were even interested in coming to LA, and I generally trust McDaniel’s staff to identify the guys they think are the best scheme fits.
If going cheaper at Guard in a system that will protect it’s IOL through quick game and screens, is the price we paid to get Njoku and Kolar into the TE room, it might end up being savvy business.
It’s a B+ or A- from me.
Hey Erick – Thoughtful commentary. A few comments:
IOL:
LBs/DBs:
Grading:
Kev,
You make fair points. I just look at a team like the Rams who see a window and they attack it. They don’t straddle the fence. I would like to see that approach when the situation calls for it. However, if Herbert in his prime, year three of Harbaugh and the hiring of McDaniel isn’t the situation, when will it ever be? Like the guys said in the Rhim interview, Hortiz is set in his ways against spending big, and that has worked for the Ravens to always be competitive, but it also hasn’t won them anything going on 14 seasons. If the expectation is to just be competitive every year and never bottoming out, then that approach has its merits. I am just aiming for something more.
Season 5? 147 episodes? Wow – congrats! Think I’ve listened to each one (which is why it was great meeting Al & Andy on my last Melbourne trip – I feel like I know you guys).
Listened to the podcast during a hot, humid sweaty round of golf. I walk – it’s usually 8ish miles, which is brutal when it’s 95. A few comments:
Derwin:
TE/Offense:
Roster/Defense:
Been very busy trying to build my company (and launch 2 others). Even if I don’t comment, I am listening and appreciate everyone’s POV.
Great hearing from you, Kev!
When you’re on a long sweaty walk along the golf course and you hear Jack grunting and making noises of excitement in your headphones it must feel like he’s walking in the bunker beside you. Together in the trenches 😆
I share your excitement for this season.
I think Herbert will have the best season of his career if he can stay healthy.
The team is deeper than it’s ever been.
The question will probably be whether we have enough star power.
I’m hopeful, like you, that the real star on Offense after Herbert will be McDaniel.
We saw what Kubiak brought to a Seattle team that, before last season, wasn’t viewed as being super talented on Offense. Nobody was talking about JSN heading into 2025. Now he’s a consensus Top 3-5 WR in the NFL.
Let’s hope to see similar results this year!
That’s one way of looking at it. I usually channel Jack when I hit a shit-shot (which is too often). The screaming curse “YaMutherFuckerAhhhhgghh” grunted like only Jack can do.
I’ve been thinking about this a lot recently. The grumbling for splash FA signings is the opposite of what this organization is about. While I think this front office understands and is willing to use every tool in the belt, the only way I see them winning a bidding war for a premier FA is if they believe that one player will put them over the top. Right now, this team is deep with quality at just about every position. That is by design.
My opinion is that McDaniel > Kubiak, Herbert > Darnold, Hampton = K9 & Ladd = JSN. Going to be fun watching what this offense looks like.
I really do not think Ladd = JSN. I can agree with the others.
You may be right. I think we will have a very good view of who is better at the end of this season. Eager to see what Ladd does in this offense.
In talking about Derwin, Jack said the team “hasn’t done anything at the LB position.” That implies a need I don’t agree with. Henley is a very good LB1. Perryman is a good early down (think run defense) LB2. Dye is a good overall LB2/3. Phillips and Wax showed real potential last season in limited defensive snaps. Colson theoretically has some level of upside that could earn him a roster spot, though I am skeptical. My point here is, they didn’t need to do anything at LB. Which makes Jack’s comment an odd one.
As for Derwin, even though I floated the idea of trading him several months ago, I came around to believing the net return on investment justified the re-signing. But not by nearly as much as so many other fans believe. I think it is very close.
Let me put it this way, suppose Derwin suffered a season ending injury right now. Do you think the team would feel compelled to scramble for another safety? I don’t. I think the team would believe that Jefferson, Molden, Mickens, Smith, and possibly even Williamson would be fine at safety. I actually think that would drive the team from 5 CBs and 5 safeties on the final roster to 6 and 4, respectively. And I think they would be fine. I’m not saying it would be no impact from losing James, far from it. But it wouldn’t hurt nearly as much as losing some other players.
“Is Ladd McConkey the most important player other than Herbert?” No, not close IMO. Slater and Alt are more important for sure. Maybe Biadasz, but perhaps not. Maybe Hampton. Maybe Tuli. Probably not Mack due to age. Probably not James (see above).
Speaking of Ladd’s YAC, I have to believe that will be solved with McDaniel replacing Roman. Same for Ladd’s overall performance.
Great to see you guys again. Hope all is well.
Great to hear from you again, Tau! Been thinking about you from time to time these last couple months and hoping that things are as good as they can be over there. I’m sure, like me, you’re happy that football is almost back to nourish our hearts and minds!
On to football….
When Jack said the team ‘hasn’t done anything’ at LB I’m guessing he meant no significant additions were made to the room.
Since Ryan, Erick and I were all hoping the team would add at least one new piece to that room (Leo Chenal was our consensus pick) I understand why he said that.And I don’t think he’s wrong either to note that Derwin’s versatility should be viewed as adding (in its totality) to the team’s strength at the second level. He can play dime LB on 3rd downs and also dominates as an overhang defender. That helps the backers.I never remembered you being so high on Henley! Coming off a 58.2 PFF Grade season and a 69.5 one before that, he’s not a guy I would have predicted you would generally get behind. I think he should have a breakout season this year (given the well-publicised health and personal issues he struggled through last year) but the way he was used in Minter’s Defense isn’t exactly what comes to my mind when I think of an LB1.
That’s probably my problem more than his, with “Mike” backers fitting my LB1 archetype. Daiyan’s a unique player. Former safety. Some similarities to Derwin really. He does more work than most true LBs as an overhang defender and patrolling the flats. He’s average to below average in the Box. He spends a lot of time Spying on 3rd down. He blitzes, but more off the edge than up the middle. He’s an interesting hybrid player and a handy piece for a DC. LB1? Guess it’s semantics.
I take your point that the team could partially cover Derwin’s absence (at least on the field) because they are deep at DB.
There’s probably a “live” question about whether that’s the best way to assess a player’s value. For example, the 2020 Rams could have theoretically had a very deep Defensive Tackle group that could’ve covered some of the loss of an Aaron Donald injury (or at least better than the team could’ve covered the loss of Jalen Ramsey). But that “depth” situation alone doesn’t mean that his loss wouldn’t have hurt nearly as much as a player at a weaker position group, does it?Either way, when I saw how the Derwin contract was structured I thought it was team friendly and essentially gave the team 2x options in 2028 and 2029 if they view him as worth $27m cap hits at that time. He could’ve pushed for more guaranteed money really ($54.5m total guaranteed v Hamilton’s $82m) having made 2x All Pro in 2024 and 2025. Seems like his agent wanted to win AAV (which he did by a nominal $100k).I’m glad he’ll be on the team for the foreseeable future and really don’t think I’ll spend too much time thinking about what else the team might’ve done with that money. But you can check back again if the IOL self immolates this season!On Ladd, I agree with you. Given the run game focus the OTs matter a lot. But interestingly, from a passing game perspective, given all the quick rhythm passing we’re expecting, that probably makes individual receiver skills more important that in some other schemes? I guess it depends how well McDaniel does scheming them open. I expect it will be very well!
Look forward to future discussions. We left so much material up our sleeve on this show. One of us had a hard out so we cut the show about an hour short. We can get to our other stuff on the next show or two.
Until then!
A final thought on Derwin.
I think an argument could be made (and I’m sure
Ryan Watkins would make this type of argument) that we are living through a mini-era of football where the pathway to becoming a Top 5 Defense is finding that Nickel/Safety hybrid that allows you to defend the run from lighter boxes, threaten blitz, but also cover TEs against the pass.
Nick Emmanwori was vital for the Seahawks playing that role. We all know about Hamilton. There really seem to be only 3-5 players in the entire NFL right now who can offer that competitive advantage to a Defense. And I think Derwin is one of them.
In that sense, I’m not sure how replaceable he really is on the field. Sure, you could bump Tarheeb inside to Nickel or drop Molden down (where he played earlier in his career) if Derwin ever got injured. But I think in doing so the Defense loses that real Top 5 ceiling (or at least potentially does!)
This is only true as written if every top 5 defense in this mini-era has such a nickel/safety hybrid. Without looking into it, I’m sure that isn’t true. Yes, it is clearly one possible path, but there are others.
You hit on why I think he is going to be fine this year. His health and personal issues were a big deal, and there is no reason to expect any of that to reoccur. He is also playing for his second contract.
If he plays well, as I expect, I think the team should let him walk next offseason for comp pick formula impact rather than paying him a market level contract. Paying Derwin like they are and Tuli like they are going to be, I don’t think it would be smart to invest more cap dollars in the LB position.
I agree, it probably isn’t the best way. I just think it is interesting that the strong safety depth the Chargers have makes it true IMO that they could more easily withstand losing Derwin than, say, the Ravens could withstand losing Hamilton.
I don’t think I would compare Derwin to Donald, which is implied here. Donald may be the best DL in history or at least in the modern era. Derwin is great, but he’s not that, hence easier to withstand and cover for the loss of Derwin than Donald.
Derwin is not the best safety in the NFL, despite his contract. He has only made 1st team All Pro once, in his rookie season in 2018. He has mostly hovered around being a top 8 safety since then. Using PFF defense grade as a proxy, his grade has ranked 6th to 8th among safeties with at least 800 snaps per season in 4 of the past 5 seasons, with 2023 being a notably poor showing for Derwin.
Don’t get me wrong. I am a big Derwin fan. As I said, I thought about the possiblity of trading him but came to believe they shouldn’t (and knew they wouldn’t anyway). I just think it is closer than most fans seem to.
Well, if they keep him for 2027, $13M of his 2028 salary becomes guaranteed. So they would have $19M in dead cap money in 2028 if they traded or released him. I’m not sure if you knew that, but I wouldn’t characterize that as a team friendly option. Agree that 2029 amounts to a team friendly option.